how to balance a flywheel and clutch

Posts: 7,924. Login with your E-Mail Address. Flywheels can be manufactured from any of a variety of materials, including various grades of steel and billet aluminum. If you hold a chalk to the side of the flywheel by a fixed mount, it will leave a mark at the same spot as it rotates. .Bi@f|nsK_A2^xMxTL-''P EU4Y#~'iwfR?Ny?|yE]EJ^yZ?6O&_'@g You may not need much weight then to balance. Yea,..you have to have everything that rotates including the washers and bolts and..andand send it to the shop and watch them balance it with the crank and all the parts attached to the crank. You also need to know for sure what imbalance the flywheel and harmonic balancer are that you have. The flywheel also balances the engine as it is specifically weighted the engines crankshaft, and most importantly, the flywheel connects the engine to the transmission through the clutch in order to provide power to the wheels. With certain factory applications,the OEM flywheel can actually be reused by having it resurfaced, creating a new layer of friction material for the clutch assembly and ultimately avoiding the cost of a replacement. Register now for free! 2 0 obj I have been told that for an external balanced flywheel that there should be 3 large circular areas taken out further in towards the center away from the starter ring. Sep 21, 2010. for teh 383 to balance correctly without an expensive flywheel any 86 and up single rear main seal flywheel and get a balance plate that bolts between the crank and flywheel fyi these plates are available for 454 as well helps save money when ya already spent a pile on small block stuff. Our job is to analyze the original flywheel and engineer major improvements. All I have seen are junk. endobj They are now taking the clutch back out to balance the flywheel and clutch together. Design by: PelicanParts.com | Powered by vBulletin Version 3.8.7Copyright 2000 - 2023, vBulletin Solutions, Inc. After the install I noticed a vibration at 1,500 rpm. Cobra Make, Engine: ERA #732, 428FE (447 CID), TKO600, Solid Flat Tappet Cam, Tons of Aluminum. Cleaning this surface prior totheinstallation is paramount for proper clutch engagement and lifespan. Another broken crank would suck!! This left me with about 14 grams out of balance. Saleen is a registered trademark of Saleen Incorporated. It is a small block LA Motor with a mild camshaft backed up by a 833 4 speed trans. front dampner and flywheel. Free shipping on all orders $100+ Lower 48 states only. MSC offers new as well as several other suppliers. Pull your crank and have it balanced then have them add parts and balance each as they go. FOLLOW: Chromoly is an abbreviation for chromium-molybdenum steel" due to its property of incorporating alloy elements chromium and molybdenum. As you drive a manual transmission car, the clutch is constantly coming in contact with the flywheel when you release the clutch pedal. Your E-Mail and/or password are incorrect. I would send ALL of it to a good machine shop & have it balanced together as a unit. I want to register an account for free right now! "the disc can land anywhere" - I shoulda thought of that! Aug 31, 2002. 475 rwhp 450 rwtq. non biased Shelby Cobra related site! Action Clutch specifically designed our Chromoly flywheels for a reduction in weight and inertia for better engine response. To balance it, you would drill holes, not weld or bolt anything to the flywheel. Issues can still come up if the two pieces are not balanced together, creating small problems like vibrations or chatter, or even larger issues like crank bearing wear, seal wear, or worse. I think that bolt in the back of the Flywheel may hit the block anyways. Who balanced your previous motor? Mustang & Lightning Tech, Articles, How To Videos, 94-04 Mustang Tech, Articles, How To Videos, SVE Flywheel - Billet Steel - 10.5" - 0/28/50oz (79-95) 5.0/5.8, Cast Iron Flywheel - 10.5" - 50oz (79-95) 5.0, McLeod Flywheel - Nodular Iron - 10.5" - 50oz (79-95) 5.0/5.8, Ford Performance Flywheel - Billet Steel - 10.5" - 50oz (79-95) 5.0/5.8, Ram Flywheel - Billet Steel - 10.5" - 50oz (79-95) 5.0/5.8, McLeod Flywheel - Aluminum - 10"/10.5" - 0/28/50oz (79-95) 5.0/5.8, Ram Flywheel - Aluminum - 10.5" - 50oz (79-95) 5.0/5.8, Ram Flywheel - Billet Steel - 10.5" - 28oz (79-95) 5.0/5.8, Ram Flywheel - Aluminum - 10.5" - 28oz (79-95) 5.0/5.8, Ford Performance Flywheel - Billet Steel - 10.5" - 0oz (79-95) 5.0/5.8. with stanchion tube ultra low friction oil. From the factory, your '82 to '95 Mustangs came with a 10 inch clutch. If you have a zero balance motor it means that you need a flywheel balanced to zero. I've come to realize that nothing has been done to this car by the previous owner's except for basic matinance, even though i was told other wise. and maybe re-balanced any time it is machined for clean-up or weight reduction. All Fidanza Performance aluminum flywheels are made from high quality 6061 T6 billet aluminum to deliver the optimum in strength and durability and are often SFI approved for race use just like steel flywheels. Colin Mc Rae MBE 1968-2007.Give a car more power and it goes faster on the straights,make a car lighter and it's faster everywhere. You will need to know what imbalance the motor is that you bought. Search Engine Optimization by vBSEO 3.6.0. off centered off balance. All flywheels are balanced and thoroughly inspected for quality and fitment. Changing a clutch in a car is never an easy task. In the 25 years I worked at an auto machine shop I'd guess I worked on over 1000 balance jobs. In drag racing, having too light of a flywheel will not slow the engine enough to allow for up-shifts. Our lightweight flywheels improve performance and assist with quicker revving. The down side is i didn't include the cost for these new parts in my engine rebuild buget :0( Oh' well there's no saving these parts, so i gotta get em all new Man this is an expensive hobby! Any time you're going to be using a clutch that has a puck typeface, semi-metallic, ceramic, doesn't matter. If you don't have your shaft balanced you will have wasted your money. Jenkins/Fidanza:Although a lightweight aluminum flywheel in certain instances is sufficient, enthusiasts may need a flywheel with more mass, or even one that has less mass than a standard aluminum lightweight flywheel. The World's largest If I was you, I would get the short block, take the crank out , at least ,( you should do the pistons too), and find a balance shop. Your cast iron flywheel, obviously, that's a great stock replacement even for mild bolt-ons. Now that we know what a flywheel does, we can see just how important it is when it comes to the balance of the transmission, clutch, and even the engine assembly. balancing , align-bore, tell him, you want the competition package done on her. Exactly !!!!! The balancing machine in the picture is supposed to have the piece being balanced spun , not too fast maybe 800 - 1000 rpm . To clear up the confusion, lets discuss the differences between the two. What is SFI? <>/ExtGState<>/Font<>/ProcSet[/PDF/Text/ImageB/ImageC/ImageI] >>/Annots[ 22 0 R] /MediaBox[ 0 0 612 792] /Contents 4 0 R/Group<>/Tabs/S/StructParents 0>> The ability of the flywheel to control heat and maintain tolerance can also prolong clutch performance and wear under extreme conditions. In most cases, a ring gear can be replaced after starter damage or failure, without the end user having to purchase a completely new unit. I have always felt balance is a good way to spend money on these engines. Copyright 2023 Endgame360 Inc. All Rights Reserved. 2023 Power Automedia. No vibration before or after the 1500 rpm mark. From the factory, your '82 to '95 Mustangs came with a 10 inch clutch. for a new computer driven machine. <> This is also why companies manufacture heavier weighted flywheels. Many applications have little-to-no drivability downsides when utilizing a light flywheel. In order to prevent any issues after installing a new clutch, or later down the line, its important to get the flywheel resurfaced by a qualified mechanic. An example of this would be a vehiclesdriveline set-up orthe type of clutch being used (pull versus push style). Many SPEC aluminum flywheel options, as well as certain steel flywheels feature a replaceable friction surface. Yea,..you have to have everything that rotates including the washers and bolts and..andand send it to the shop and watch them balance it with the crank and all the parts attached to the crank. Have you been searching for the correct flywheel for your 82-95 Mustang? We check for many things when engineering a flywheel, such as overall balance, flywheel clearances or how improve the design. PP and flywheel get balanced as an assembly, the disc does not. Ultra lightweight flywheels which are designed specific for race applications such as SCCA or SOLO racing androad course tracks these tend to be too light for street use, and can cause adverse affects in regular stop and go driving or traffic like stalling or high revving starts. Our Chromoly lightweight flywheels have gone through and passed engineering tests up to 15,000-18,000 RPM.All our Chromoly Flywheels are heat treated for extreme durability and saves you money by resurfacing multiple times. If it's a puck-type clutch, you're going to want to use either a billet steel or billet aluminum flywheel because a cast iron flywheel will just chew itself up. Factory flywheel was cast iron, and six . spec's from the shop manual which you can buy from Don, to him.. ask him nicely if would assemble the lower end for you. Colin Chapman. These engines needed more weight to balance them so Detroit put some of the extra needed weight . (REGISTERED USERS DO NOT SEE THIS POST/AD! Flywheel Tolerance What Is It? 79 93 mustang I keep a crank on hand that has been balanced by it's self to use as a mandrel to mount front or rear bits for balance. If you read the manual it also states that the flywheel and pulley aren't keyed so you have to scribe the items to the crank and measure the balance pins depth, look at . FW Clutch have rebuilt a number of NLA clutches for vintage cars we've worked on. I trust my engine rebuilder implicitly. I recently had a Mcleod Street Extreme clutch along with a Mcleod steel flywheel installed on my 2000 Mustang GT. Now comes the next question, what materials do you want to use with what? You can get your damper repaired at this place. 4 0 obj How "balanced" are we talking? As such, the flywheel can obtain hot spots due to the excessive friction and heat over time, which in turn can cause vibration whenever its engaging and when the vehicle is under acceleration. Whether youre searching for a flywheel application for drag racing, autocross, road racing, or a daily driver, well help make your choice easier by discussing different materials and manufacturing processes. Many enthusiasts can agree that a lightweight flywheel is ideal, simply because they have alower MOI. When suspended with the marks 120 degrees apart, the unit hung to one side. Static is a good place to start but spinning the assembly is better also if you have the clutch plate centered in the assembly. Little known fact Vizard has driven my race cars and I have a collection of pre publication manuscirpts I have proof read for him. The clutch cover was also out of balance (about 20 grams). Also, enthusiasts must prioritize performance and drivability. The flywheel can typically be resurfaced pretty easily and should be a relatively low-cost procedure. Here a copy of a post that I did a few months back. Randy, I've been using Fort Wayne clutch in (Big surprise here) in Fort Wayne IN for years. Dan Jenkins, Fidanza Performance. For starters, you have your stock style, cast iron replacement flywheels. Feel free to call us 208-453-9800. This s a big reason but not the only one why serious racers build niter ally balanced engines as then all that needs to be done to interchange parts like the flywheel or flexplate . With so many choices on the market today, it can be difficult to choose the right one for a specific application. #6. Which made it a very common upgrade to make the switch to a 10 and 1/2 inch clutch whenever you go to swap out the clutch. p.s. This video shows how I went about balancing my LC Engineering flywheel (35 lb steel) and AISIN CTX-107 pressure plate. zildjian4life218 said: I just replaced my LS7 clutch that is in my car with a Monster stage 2. Roush is a registered trademark of Roush Enterprises Inc. Eaton is a trademark of the Eaton Corporation. When it comes to flywheel options, more specifically, a lightweight flywheel, many enthusiasts worry about the issues associated with them. Norton/Spec:Chassis setup, power curve, gearing, and tires are variables to consider when choosing inertia properties. If in doubt, flat out. set cam timing??? With so many performance flywheel options on the market today, it can be difficult to understand all of the different items available. You need to check with the shop that did your balance work or any of your machine work to find out what flywheel you need to order. I'm sure there are more, that's who our shop and myself have used. Check out LMR's flywheel guide for all of the answers! The factory might use round weights to be riveted onto the edge of the cover. If you put a 28 oz flywheel, one that has a 28 oz weight tacked on somewhere on the outer circumference of the flywheel , the motor will vibrate like mad, eventually breaking something. Hovsepian/Quarter Master: Whether it's a lightweight or neutral weighted flywheel, it must be balanced no question about it. We make sure to not go too light to prevent poor idle and driving issues like some of the ultra-lightweight brands. 3912 Whittier BlvdLos Angeles, CA 90023(323) 269-6051. ENGINEERED FOR BOTH STREET AND RACE APPLICATIONS. Fidanza Performance applies a unique protective coating to identify any remaining oil or residue from its machining process to each of its flywheel and clutch assemblies. My answer is a qualified yes. don't even ask him " how much " when he calls and says it ready, just go down there with a wad of cash and pay the man and thank him. , For a better experience, please enable JavaScript in your browser before proceeding. If the flywheel and clutch assembly are out of balance, noise, vibration, and harshness levels will dramatically increase, and will inevitably cause extreme damage to the engine, transmission, or driveline. SPEC reduces unwanted weight on a vehicles driveline by reducing mass in its entire clutch assembly, starting with its flywheel. Like many other go-fast parts, the flywheel is not a one-size fits all type of component. Most flywheels we produce are designed as a neutral, or as close-to-zero balance as possible, and are independently balanced to ensure they meet the criteria set for proper balance weight and are within the allowable tolerances. The manufacturers we involved in this article have dedicated an immenseamount of research and engineering to develop a high-performance, highly capable flywheel for virtually any application imaginable. Fifty tonne power station turbines are balanced this way. Website content, text, & images Copyright 2023 LMR.com - All Rights Reserved. However, if a flywheel is manufacturedfor an ultra-lightweight application, then we wouldnt recommend resurfacing it. balancer, flywheel, piston ringsthe whole shooting match along with the " Correct " eng. The flywheel will be easy, the cast weight will be small for 28oz early style, and large for 50oz . :0). Just order the clutch/flywheel from DTE. I am still welcome to drop by and use any machine in the shop. As for the clutch disc don't bother with it as it is light and stops in a different place each time. Mine is but a fairly standard 1293 (because that was the bore available) but with new bits - cam/lifters/push rods, connecting rods, crank, lightweight flywheel, clutch. All rotating bits will be balanced by a shop that has done A Series engines for quite some timeincluding my 1380at a cost of $125 (price for 4 cylinder engines). eV/ .c}%&?i.csayH,/~D^U! }X2pF?Ui4+D9?zsz0k n'O|oF}O3I}oa-7|. This is the point we are trying to get across. MSC offers new as well as several other suppliers. The Fora platform includes forum software by XenForo. Our flywheels are built for racing and performance. They are made from a durable one-piece billet chromoly steel or chromoly steel forgings. With so many different choices readily available, we wanted to know how the different materials can affect the overall integrity of the flywheel and its drivability characteristics. The flywheel is a component of a manual transmission that helps to transfer power from the engine to the transmission. It needs to be spun up and dynamically balanced. They are balanced and no metal had to come off or be added. Oct 27, 2007. Check with the vehicle manufacturer for testing specifications. For not a lot of money the crank could/should be done also. Jenkins/Fidanza:The most common material types includesteel, aluminum, and nodular iron. Flywheel Runout. Its recommended to balance the entire assembly as a whole after verifying the tolerance level of the flywheel itself. As long as the clutch and pressure plate bolt up and have the proper static pressure engagement then they will work together. This is known as "Detroit Balance". If the flywheel is too worn and cannot be resurfaced, then it is advisable to replace the whole thing with a new part. 833 likes, 23 comments - Weekend Automotive - Saurabh kmph (@saurabh.kmph) on Instagram: "It was not an easy job to make an Indica run.. @trollkul just nailed it and . David Norton, SPEC Clutch. The following information will help you choose the correct flywheel. Although some parts can be reused when changing a clutch, its often advisable to replace everything with new parts and get the flywheel resurfaced. Steel is the best friction surface for most materials because it offers a good seatability and wear pattern. Mal stop me man, Hey I'm OK. All of our flywheels are SFI Certified which meet the top performance standards in the automotive and motorsports industries. Our goal for this question-and-answer session is to discuss many frequently asked questions regarding the flywheel, and to help enthusiasts gain a better understanding of the science behind them. Hi guys. If you have a zero balance motor it means that you need a flywheel balanced to zero. With so much inconsistency in enthusiast reports of flywheel performance, we felt this was a topic that merits discussion. The boys here get $125. Due to the loss in mass, these tend to require changes in your driving habits which can be a bit irritating for daily use. Norton/SPEC:All SPEC flywheel applications can be machined or rebuilt by replacing a removeable friction surface. SPEC maintains a one-one-thousandth machine tolerance to assure a perfect rotational integrity, fast clutch seating, and maximized drivability. I'm sure you do as well. Four cyl engines have the worst natural balance characteristics. In the literal sense, a flywheel is a large metal disc that usually made out of cast iron, steel, or aluminum and its usually thick and heavy to prevent warpage during use. I built my first Cooper S engine in 73/74 and when I started it and got it running perfect it shook so bad at certian RPMs I took it apart and had it balanced and installed new rings. 5.0Resto, SVE, LMR are registered trademarks of Latemodel Restoration Supply, Inc. Ford, SVT, Special Vehicle Team, Ford Mustang, Ford Lightning, Mach 1, Mach-E, Shelby GT500, GT350, GT350R, New Edge, Boss 302, 5.0, Cobra R, Fox Body Mustang, Ghia, Turbo GT, SVT Cobra, Cobra Jet, Bullitt, California Special, Cobra, GT, V6, S197, SN95, S550, S650, Dark Horse, F-Series, F-150, Triton, F150 Raptor, Raptor, EcoBoost, Bronco, Bronco Sport, Badlands, Big Bend, Black Diamond, Outer Banks, Wildtrak, and Sasquatch are all registered trademarks of Ford Motor Company. I'm Jay Mack with latemodelrestoration.com and I wanted to take a few minutes to talk to you about the differences between 1982 to '95 five liter Mustang flywheels. A quick image of a SPEC clutch and flywheel combination being manufactured. Not a lot of $ so you may be good tehre. Not that it matters but FYI I began working in the auto aftermarket in 1965 at age 16 with a work permit. Our aluminum flywheels are made from 6061-T6 Billet Aluminum or 1045 / 4140 Billet Steel depending on application. Action Clutch specifically designed our Chromoly flywheels for a reduction in weight and inertia for better engine response. You may want to go ahead and step up to billet steel. how to install and prime the oil pump??? Not saying it would be a bad choice in the streetcar, but you will notice you take a little bit more clutch slip to get the car moving. Our flywheels are engineered to improve throttle response, quicker shifting, and reduces clutch wear depending on your drivability. These different types of flywheels do not necessarily affect the clutch assembly or operation, as most are actually designed to work with specific style clutches to avoid any adverse affects. Really !!!!! Price of balance went up. fyi - for stock bellhousings, you have to match the flywheel size with the bellhousing & the flywheel determines your clutch choices. Weve all heard stories of clutch chatter, balancing issues, and possible damage caused to the driveline components. For example, a very light flywheel can make a clutch feel more aggressive. I try for the very best result. CA, Cobra Make, Engine: 1989 KCC from South Africa Right Hand Drive. The companys billet aluminum flywheel options are manufactured to a specific tolerance in-order to provide the entire clutch assembly with a quiet and functional operating quality, while reducing rotating mass on the driveline components. Can't wait to get it installed now. YES! Check for imbalance by revving a known good engine to 2500-3000 rpm with the clutch pedal depressed and feeling for any flywheel vibration. do you know how to set the ring end gap? Cobra Make, Engine: Everett-Morrison LS1. Always remember to do it right the first time, because its done wrong, there might not be a second time. When a clutch assembly begins to wear outandneeds to be replaced, the friction surface of that flywheel in that clutch assembly is often resurfaced instead of being replaced. The goal is to make a power application the most efficient, as its not always about where the car is driven. Action Clutch lightweight aluminum flywheels are designed, engineered and manufactured in the USA. It is machined from the highest quality 6061-T6 or 2024 T3 aluminum, each flywheel is manufactured to deliver optimum tensile strength, great heat dissipation and major weight reduction. Balancing a flywheel is very important for rotational integrity and safety, and drivability. All rights reserved. This is done by adding weight to the outer extremities of the cover. The whole assembly is then spun up to measure vibration, and the clutch cover (pressure plate assembly) is then balanced. They are specifically made for light to high tuned racing cars that see drag racing, drifting, autocross, street use, and rally events. It should also be checked If i hadn't begun working on my car, my clutch would of only lasted about a month, give or take. I would look elsewhere and for a knowledgeable Mini person to do my work if i were you, a Mini crank absolutely needs balancing don't do it and you will regret it down the road. Do what you want to. Norton/SPEC:The flywheel is the component that contributes the mostto the performance and the overall drivability of the clutch system. A device like that will show the heavy spot at 6 o'clock but it doesn't tell you how much to take off, bit of "hit and miss". Had two crank grinders running all the time. It will be set up in a spin balancing machine to be run up to a speed of several hundred RPM to measure vibration. All of your factory flywheels were cast iron, six-bolt pattern, and also fifty-ounce imbalance. These types of vehicles require a bit more weight to maintain proper idle and to get the momentum to move off the line. According to Vizards book crank balancing is fine if you have the cash and the time, but not really cost-effective. Do what you want to do. "DETROIT" FLYWHEEL BALANCE - Certain model engines now being produced have incorporated a counter weight in the flywheel to compensate for the lack of counter weight in the crankshaft. There are a lot of different components to work with and remove before even getting to the clutch pack and when you finally do, you have to install the clutch and flywheel perfectly and then put everything back together so as to ensure you dont have to do the job again. Sabeo.m I just bought a nice used FW off fleeBay. There is a thread describing this on here. I think that bolt in the back of the Flywheel may hit the block anyways. Living in San Diego for most of his life, Harrison was exposed to a variety of cars at an early age. PS: Nick Swift came over and drove one of my vintage cars to a VIR Gold Cup win as well. Life is tough, but it's tougher when you're stupidJohn Wayne. I want to register an account for free right now! We know all too well how difficult and confusing it can be to match a flywheel with the appropriate clutch. When parts for the old balance machine went NLA they spent $28000. That doesn't mean the shop did like that, they could have made your 327 into an externally balanced engine, but I doubt they did that. :cheers: MTI 383 Stroker Motor. With the combination of materials, Chromoly has an outstanding strength to weight ratio and is stronger and harder than standard 1020 steel or other aluminum flywheels on the market. I'm sure it will be just fine it was before. All rights reserved. Were all for getting new parts, but does the flywheel really need to be resurfaced? 94 04 mustang As we mentioned earlier, the flywheel is a specific component which must also be matched with the correct clutch assembly for that application. These can be found in drag racing applications, and even for marine use. I guess that's why matinance records are so important when buying an older car especailly a 911. ENGINEERED FOR STREET AND LIGHT RACE APPLICATIONS. Related problem. For starters, it provides the initial inertia to get the engine running and also provides the rotational inertia to keep it going, otherwise, the engine would stall when you lift your foot off the gas. When you purchase through links on our site, we may earn an affiliate commission, which supports our community. As received, a new flywheel from the factory should be balanced within some industry standard, like a few grams or a few ounce-inches. Hopefully those motors have ALL the balance in the harmonic balancer & there are no extra weights on the flex plate/converter. He indicated that 4 cylinder cranks usually are fine and don't need balancing. The lighter a flywheel is, the faster it spools up RPM; but also means the harder it is to start from a standstill. Once you've indexed the pressure plate you can drill some holes in the casing to remove metal. Do I need to get the flywheel balanced together with a new clutch disk & Pressure plate? Doing the rods, pistons and crank with all rotating parts other than disc current price is $250 to $280. Your Login Failed. So whats the best option for reliability? I now have a noticeable vibration above 3000 rpm. endobj PLASTIGAUGE the crank bearings? Spec 3 and Fedenza, no balancing no problems. Jerry I am just trying to help..I also did some learning the hard way.. For the small cost while it is all apart and especially as it is a 1275 3 bearing engine why wouldn't you do it ?????? Sounds like $75 for the job, such a deal. The style of driving or racing will usually determine the need for a specific style clutch, which will strictly translate to the type of flywheel necessary as well. So, instead of drilling balancing holes into my brand new flywheel (which is really the correct way to balance everything individually), I just opted to offset the heavy point of the flywheel against the light point of the clutch cover. We'll send you the most interesting LSX Magazine articles, news, car features, and videos every week. This translates to higher exit speeds coming out of corers and higher top-end speed at the end of the straights on the race track. so how many engines have you guys balanced????? They celibrate their 95th this year. Let us know how it goes. 3 0 obj Car is an 1986 Cutlass with a 6.0L LS engine and the transmission is a T56. The posts are mounted to the plate base which should be on rubber mounts to the feet. Hey Randy, since the disc can land anywhere, it should be balanced as a sole unit (if not shipped balanced perfectly, doesn't hurt to check). That's only good for static balance. That must be a clutch only price. Any guidance would be appreciated. However, that same flywheel would warp or even flex under the load of a larger style diaphragm clutch.

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